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Well, everybody, welcome. I’m Jaime Miller and we’re here with Olga, one of my students who finished with TOEFL in 2020, the worst year ever for a lot of us. And I am really excited because we’re going to be talking with her about the results that she got studying with TOEFL. This is such a special opportunity for you to hear somebody who’s gotten higher than 26 on the speaking section.
And to know like what that journey and what that transformation is like. So Olga, not just me, but I know everybody watching is also just so grateful for the time and the energy and your bravery in doing this. So we thank you for that. And there may be some interruptions as this happens. Olga’s at home, I’m at my micro office and there can be some construction noises in the background.
So, you know, we apologize for that, but this is real life. So it’s just how it is. So yeah. So Olga, thank you. Thank you. And first I want to say congratulations. I think it’s been a couple of weeks since you got the news that you’re finished with TOEFL.
Actually, it’s been three weeks.
How’s that going?
It’s going just amazingly. Perfect. I would say it going, it’s going in the way that it should be going long time ago. I mean, I was trying to reach my goal for not one year, for more than two years, more than three years, it’s been a long, long journey. I started when we came to the United States in 2013.
I’m a physical therapist and I needed to reach a really high score on TOEFL, especially on speaking section and writing section.
I remember there are not, well, yeah, your reading and your listening are not controlled by physical therapy board or…
They actually require a certain level but the level that they require, I reached a few years ago. So it wasn’t my main issue.
My goal was to reach, to pass writing and speaking sections.
Right. And you were, you were stuck with that? Yeah, absolutely. Yes.
I was stuck for a long time, unfortunately. Fortunately, because I met you.
If you’re cool with it, can we, can we dig in and just like, look at what your score history was before you started with me?
Because well, and actually let’s cut to the chase. So what was your speaking score at your last test? Two–your last two tests?
You mean my last test? A recent test?
Yeah. Your ones. Yeah. Your speaking scores.
Yeah. Okay. So we’re just going to put that out there because I want to lead with the good news, which is that yeah. Olga got 28 on speaking two times the last two tests, which she took and writing your scores. We’re I’m just checking…
They went up as well. It was 23, I think. And 25.
Yeah. I had a 24 and then 25. So what is, yeah, so that’s just the end point with all of that.
So I’m just going to share that here so that we can take a look at it. The writing score is the one over here on the side. And what I think is important is just to lead with that. But like, we’re going to go back in time. We’re going to look at like where Olga was before, but like Olga, you really like raised your confidence level through studying with TOEFL and you had very dramatic changes in your scores.
And I think what’s interesting, you know, cause from my side, like I always sit in my chair, I’m always watching people come and take TOEFL and like, I see the progression, I see the development, but very few students have any, I mean, how would you know what that progression normally looks like or should look like or is supposed to look like?
And I think it’s really valuable to see that it wasn’t always that, that high, you know, you didn’t always have such high writing scores always have such high speaking. Yeah. Yeah.
My high score on speaking, I think was 24. It was 2015. I took TOEFL that time. I think I was in the, some certain of, you know, progress with TOEFL. I made really good with reading and my listening was pretty well. And I remember, yeah.
What were you doing? I’m sorry to interrupt you, but like you were taking classes or?
Honestly, at this time I think I was taking classes at our local library and it was group classes.
Where all the experts are all the TOEFL experts are at the library.
Well, we had an ESL teacher there. Yeah. And she was fine. She was really good teacher. And what helped me a lot, it was conversation time with the group and I think it was really helpful, but you know, it didn’t make a huge difference. I needed more, I needed 26 plus and I couldn’t make it. By that time, I think I’ve got credential evaluation from an organization that usually data for physical therapist here in the end, in the United States. And I was ready to continue with my process for license. And on the way I felt like I just can’t continue because I was really stuck. I was stuck. And I tried and I tried and I failed failed again.
During this time, like, did you have anybody help you with like writing essays or like what, what you should put in essays? Like what should be in integrated or the independent? Like that one time?
Yeah. Yeah. That’s true. And I think that on 2016, I took online preparation course with a test success academy in New York. And they really helped me.
They helped me a lot with again, was reading strategies and with listening. But I remember I was struggle with writing the time as well. And my tutor couldn’t help me. He tried to give me many different examples, how to write essay and what I can do in order to memorize maybe some phrases, you know, common phrases to use, but nothing specific.
And every time I went to TOEFL, I was about to cry after, because I was so upset after.
I think it’s really normal people as adults. Like we learn to cover that and to hide the frustration that we have, but I can’t tell you how many people are going through exactly that kind of thing. And if we’re being honest about that, you know, there’s yeah. It’s, it definitely brings up a lot of emotions. So I’m not surprised.
Yeah. Jaime I’m telling you and this thing made me cry. Really!
No, I know. Okay. But you’re, you’re definitely not the only one, you know, and I mean, I’ve seen, I’ve seen men cry over TOEFL too.
I mean, it can be so incredibly, incredibly frustrating just especially when you’re, you know, you’re not sure what to do. And I, and I believe that you probably felt like you were trying everything you could, you were trying your hardest, you know, you were doing everything that you could think of.
Honestly, I was thinking maybe I’m not good enough. Maybe something is wrong with me.
Yeah. Yes, no, I know. Yeah. I mean, it’s, it’s one of the things we talked about a lot, like in private lessons and I say it a lot in the group sessions that we do. It’s like, why you are stuck with TOEFL is not because of TOEFL it’s because of your relationship with yourself.
So you’re hitting on exactly that thing. Like you started to wonder, you know, if you’re not good enough, like what’s the issue. So yeah. It’s, this is really common.
I was really down. Absolutely.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. It’s so normal. It’s so normal. So, okay. So it was, it was terrible basically, but I guess you were continuing to look for help. How did you find me online? And I’m interested when you did like…
Yeah, that’s interesting. Because at some point I said, no, I don’t want to be humiliated anymore. And I just quit. I stopped trying. And I said to myself, maybe I should change gear. Maybe I should try something else.
Like a different job, a different career, give up your degree, give up everything. Yeah.
And I took a break pretty long break since 2016 until I actually reached out. So that was like three and a half years. Maybe. Yeah. During this time I wasn’t really looking for help or, you know, trying to find any, anything to make me feel better about TOEFL.
But from time to time, I was interested, you know, and what people think about TOEFL what people do. And there were not that much information, you know, available online.
Did you give up or were you just like taking a break? Like I’m interested in how you considered that.
Yeah. That’s interesting question. Because right now I think I took a break, but that time I was pretty sure that I’m just done with this right now. Not anymore. I’m not doing it anymore. Right. That’s it. At some point I was checking my group on Facebook and it’s nothing to do with TOEFL by the way, it just social and network, the group, the name of the group is mothers of the United States.
Okay. And I saw some chat. People talked about what profession you can maybe do in United, in the United States, after you finished your bachelor degree, what can you do? How can you continue with what you have? But you don’t have to do exactly the same profession. I mean, you can just, you know, and maybe take some kind of courses.
Or, and I saw in one chat, people talked about TOEFL and one person mentioned your name. And you know, I just, I don’t know why I decided to check out. And it was, I think It’s funny. I’m glad that you did, But I put it aside. I’m telling you because…
You weren’t starting TOEFL like, yeah. You know, I understand. Yeah.
I put it aside and I put like a bookmark to myself. Here we go. Maybe, you know, at some point I will check what is going on for TOEFL.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. Yeah.
This is what happened actually on the pandemic time changed many things around us for good and for bad, mostly for, for many people, it was a disaster, but I can tell you right now that for me, it was a good time because I could spend time with myself to myself. And finally I found you, I started your program in June last summer. Yeah. 2020. Yes. And it was like explosion, you know, just explosion in my brain.
But a good one, right?
Absolutely. No, It was the best experience I’ve had for many years. And it’s not only about tutors and English teachers just overall. I had so much fun just having a conversation with you and listening to, because I think that you, more than a English teacher, ESL teacher, you’re a life coach. You taught me so many things.
Well, the reason why you were stuck with TOEFL, wasn’t just because of TOEFL. I mean, yeah. We could talk about the strategies.
But you figure it out, The main issue in this case, you like a good physical therapist that have modalities and you can know exactly what patient, what patient needs. Exactly. What kind of modalities, you know, so you, you just know what to do with different people. You have really well accommodations for everyone, and I’m sure that my success is something that I have to be grateful for what you’ve done.
Well, I appreciate that. I’m not going to say that like, you know, well, it’s, it’s partnership. I mean, I think that that’s really what it comes down to is it ends up being teamwork in this situation between you and me, you know, guiding you towards that goal. But one thing that I think is important to talk about too, is the time that you were able to spend with this, because like you mentioned, the pandemic gave you this kind of time and you’ve got children as well. So for many of the women that are studying with me, balancing family and TOEFL studies is something that’s really challenging for them.
You know, especially with moms, like moms want to be supermom, they want to do everything. They want to be the best mom and the best wife and the best, you know, whatever, and also study. And we always have limited time every day about making those choices. So I’m interested to hear from you how you balanced family responsibilities with studying for TOEFL and how you navigated that.
Because I think that that’s a very real life day-to-day challenge for so many women that are in your shoes.
Yeah. In my case, Jaime, I think that the situation that our kids were at home actually helped me a lot. Yes. Because usually what I was doing, I was driving them from, from class to class after school, you know, so many after-school activities, three kids, it was really challenging. Just spend time, anytime I didn’t have time.
There’s no more activities, there’s zero activities. 10 years, 10 hours of your life every week.
Not exactly, but my husband also was home. So it was really helpful. Yes. I usually, you know, usually, usually, usually in not, not in the situation of pandemic. Yeah. People go for work, you know, they have to commute. And my husband stayed at home that time and he is very supportive and he helped me a lot with the kids. So I think the situation with the COVID actually was, had a positive impact on everything I did in my case.
Because, you know yeah. like let’s just be so real and honest about this. Like you have a family and that didn’t stop you. But getting that support I think is so important. And I know that a lot of the women that I talk to have to figure out a new way of doing things, you know, asking for help from their spouse or even after they ask, receiving and taking that help can sometimes be really difficult again, because I think that when you’ve been a mom, but even if you’re a new mom, even for the women that are new moms, I think culturally around the world, there’s just this feeling that women, we have to do it alone. We’ve got to do all these things, like all that.
We just have to just carry all of it on our backs and just like keep going with all of it. You know? And so I think it’s really wonderful so that you were open to that, you know, like you saw an opportunity to receive help about your family and not just that it was there, which is awesome, but you received it.
You know, I got this feeling with you that I’m going to make it. That’s why I think everything just, you know, worked out.
Well. It’s, it’s amazing cause I remember looking at your essays very early on, you know, you came to the classes where we talked about how to get a writing score of 24 and we looked at model essays and you were studying with the 24+ Writing Tutorial and to come into the sessions and stuff and you sent me your essays.
And I was like, how did you, I remember like looking back at your, your document. And I was like, wait, what was your writing score? Wait, like, like it was like 21, 23. And I was just like, how’s that even possible? Because the essays that you were sending me were like so much better than that.
And I was just like, there’s no way those numbers just did not represent your score. You know? So what do you feel like changed the most from like coming to classes? Was it like confidence about what to write or the style or the strategies? Or what was it because I didn’t teach you grammar. I didn’t teach you a bunch of vocabulary.
You came to me with great English. That’s the result of your previous teachers, your studies, everything that you did before you got to me, you know, so what was it that you think like really made that difference?
I’ll tell you what, I think well structure performance and very logical writing. This is what made the difference, because I was frustrated every time I got some, eh, topic, I was really frustrated. It took me so long just to get the best idea that I think I felt that it’s going to be the best idea ever. And you taught me that I don’t need to do this. I mean, I can grab the first idea that I have and make it work.
Gotcha. Okay. Okay. So it was like approach and then confidence, I guess, like knowing that it was okay.
It’s just a strategy that you gave many different types of strategies and this strategy just worked well for me, that was the one. Yeah. I think, and time management, time management was an issue. And when I started to practice with a 15 minutes writing, instead of 30 minutes, it helped me so much.
Oh, I just got a little message that my internet connection’s unstable. Can you still hear me? Yes. Oh, good. All right. Okay. I don’t know if we’re going to have a problem with that, but all right. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So yeah, you were saying, right. So just some different strategies and things, and I,
I don’t know if it’d be hard to remember it at this point, but if you had to estimate, like, after you joined the classes with me and started following the ESA Method, do you have any sense of approximately how many integrated and independent essays you wrote?
Yes, I think, yes. I can count them on my fingers.
Oh, really? What? Less than 10?
Yes. I think that.
Oh, really? That’s so unusual. Okay. I just want to say that that’s really unusual because normally when I suggest that to people, it’s like 25-30 essays, something like that. So I just kind of wants to highlight that, but a unique situation.
No, no. Are you asking me after I started with you or before?
No. After. Oh, well let’s okay. Let’s do before. Let’s say before. So let’s go before. So how many, so how many essays during this time, period, how many do you think that you wrote?
No more than 10. Okay. So sort of like maximum tasks and essays, like five and six. It was what I was doing.
I was going through different essays that other people actually wrote mine. Gotcha. Okay. And then if we’re going to measure like something between this point, like after those classes started and then to get to 24 and then to get to 25, I’ll tell you yeah. Independent or integrated, integrated. I think I made a, I wrote everything that I could on the list.
So that’s like probably 52. I, yeah, approximately 50. Okay. And then independent. That’s a family conversation. Yeah. That’s okay. We, we knew that this was my, no, my husband, he said, thank you for saving us money. Oh, well you’re welcome. And then how many independent essays do you think?
Independent, I think around maybe 40. Yeah. Okay. So something like maybe almost a hundred, we’re getting pretty close there to like approximately, you know, like a hundred. Okay. And the reason why I want to bring this up is because then so many people, some of whom I know are still studying with my program, they’ve maybe written like five essays, and then they say, Jaime, it’s still difficult. You know, what’s wrong? And I’m like, it’s just numbers. It’s numbers. The problem is numbers.
You know, like I think probably what you experienced is that you write and you write and you write and you write. And eventually somewhere in there after 10 essay is after 15 essays, something starts to change. And after 20 essays, after 25, something starts to shift. Right. I believe that was out. Good feedback from you. I don’t think that I would made a, this, you know, score anyway, because I can write essays, but if I don’t know what exactly wrong with my essay, what can I fix?
And how can I fix it? You know? So it’s not only how many essays I wrote. It’s actually what the quality, not the quantity. It’s more quality. Quality of the feedback. Yeah. The quality of feedback. Okay. So maybe let, let’s get into that a little bit. So, you know, there’s other tutors and schools where, you know, you’ll do homework and you’ll get feedback, not to put you or any of the people that you studied with on the spot too much before. But could you come up with a couple of the differences? Like what would you say is different about my…
Absolutely. I’ll tell you the first thing that I actually was really surprised is that you told us at our first meeting that you took TOEFL multiple times.
Oh yes. I’ve taken TOEFL. Oh, that’s surprised you. Okay. Very much. I’ll tell you why, because none of my tutors or any other teachers for ESL classes or English classes, they never, never took TOEFL. I think that’s so funny. I remember I’ve like, I’ve argued with teachers about this before. I, like, there was a period of time, like back during the English success Academy project where I was, I used to write, you know, articles and things to help teachers like work with students. And this was a really common thing. And I was always suggesting to teachers that if they want to tutor for TOEFL or IELTS or whatever, they should go take the test. And I can’t tell you, this is like the most controversial thing that you could say is you should go take the test. People like emailed me, teachers emailed me. And they were like, really? Why? It’s so difficult! Or I don’t think I need to do it. I’m like, whatever. I’m not going to fight with them about it. But I mean, I,
I know that there, there are things that I learned taking TOEFL that I would never learn sitting in this chair, in my office, or like, you know, lecturing about stuff. Like you just, you have to get it through experience, you know? Absolutely. That’s what I loved the first sentence. I’ve heard you. I said, wow, that’s amazing. This is the person I want to learn from. I’m glad. Maybe I should say that more often. Yeah. I’ve taken TOEFL before. Yeah. And I have really bad photos too. That’s the thing, my I’m just looking over at my pictures. They’re like the worst pictures on my TOEFL reports. They’re very embarrassing. But yeah,
I do actually, I have them on my website. Cause I think that’s important, but so, okay. So that made a difference for you because Yes, absolutely. Because I think that if someone experienced what is TOEFL all about and tried to be in the position that students, how they feel, what they actually experience on the real test, this person probably understands how to help.
And I, I just, I’m telling you the truth. This is the main reason why I actually believed in what you offered at the first place. It was the main reason. And then when we started and we continued with the course and I saw the results not on my TOEFL. I mean, I can, I can feel what is going with me.
I started with one and I, you know, during the course and during the program, during working through I felt that I’m going up and up and up. I’m just reaching the goal. Finally, I was so close that I, I talked to myself now I have to go October. I think it was October. I said, now I think I’m ready to go and check what exactly is going on with me.
That’s so awesome. Because I think from the place where you were a few years before that, I was just thinking like, I’m done with, TOEFL like, that’s it, you know, I’m going to change careers, you know? Yeah. Like to get to that point. That’s really awesome that you came back to that and yeah. Okay. Sorry.
I interrupted your story. So you were saying, so, so you went in October and you checked. And I checked and on that day, I don’t know what happened. I just missed the whole portion of the reading. It was funny. I came from the TOEFL not crying. No, no, no. There was laughing. Yeah. That’s good.
It’s good to have that. First of all, I was laughing because I could complete, I, I finished writing. I was done with the writing and I thought to myself, wow, I’m impressed because I really, I knew what to write and I nailed it bad. On the reading section. I just missed 10 questions because I don’t know. Somehow I felt that there were only three passages instead of four.
And you know, I was relaxed. Well, let let’s, can we just have some perspective here? I mean, when you went back to that exam in October, that was the first time that you had been there in like almost four years since the last test. So I’m going to be so patient and like, I mean, let’s just be very real about that.
Like when, even when people haven’t gone for like a year or like eight months or something, when they go back, it can be a little bit difficult and you hadn’t been in there for like four years. So, I mean, yeah. Like zero judgment that it wasn’t what you expected. Basically. That’s all, it just kind of caught you by surprise and a couple of different ways.
So it’s, you know, it happens. So Anyway, my reading was, eh, the big concern, because 10 questions out, I canceled my scores and I didn’t know on the day of the test, on the day of the test. So I didn’t know. So if I’m canceling my scores, I cannot get no writing and no speaking. So we don’t, we’ll never know what happened that day. I’ll never know. I think I passed fifth time speaking, writing. Yeah. Reasonable. Yeah. It seems reasonable. It definitely, we have seen at least an improvement. So then you went back again. Okay. Yes. What did gave me the day is just, my self-confidence went really up from being down. It went up and I said to myself, now I can do this. And it doesn’t matter how many times it will take me.
That’s such an important thing. I just really want to highlight that. Cause I was literally like an hour ago, I was having a conversation with a woman who wants to take TOEFL, she’s been studying for a long time and she hasn’t taken the test. And I said, that’s very interesting because there’s this fear that a lot of us have about making mistakes and messing up and failing, which is so painful that it just stops us from being able to try again with that. And I, and I think it’s, it’s especially amazing in a situation where, when somebody’s like, what you’re saying, you gave up for a while and in 2016, when you stopped that for you was quitting. Now you can look back on it and say that it was a break, but at the time it felt very real to you. And what I think happens for a lot of people emotionally, psychologically during that time when they’re like not doing it anymore is they’re not doing it because they’re protecting themselves. They’re not doing it because it’s so difficult to fail.
It’s so frustrating. It’s so expensive. It’s so stressful. It’s so disappointing or like damaging in some way that they’re just like, Nope, not doing that because it’s not safe. And so for you to have gone through that and then come back again to the point where like, you felt like you could do it and it would be okay if you made a mistake, it would be okay if the scores are low and you can still go back and try it again, you weren’t broken at that point. You weren’t like a fragile little cracker cupcake holding yourself together with just like some sugar and glue. Like, don’t let it rain on me because like you could hold yourself together. Like that I think is just really important to identify because that is actually what people need.
Like if you want to finish, not just you, anybody wants to finish with TOEFL, that’s what we have to get back to is like that kind of internal strength. Like it’s actually okay to fail. And that’s where I think that life coaching part of like what I think I bring to the table, that’s different. It’s like, yeah, of course we got to talk about TOEFL and we got to talk about grammar and we got to talk about strategies or whatnot.
But at the end of the day, you can have all of those things. You can do things, right. But if you don’t have that confidence, like what I feel we really we, developed, like through some of the private work that we did of like getting to the heart of that for you of like, why is it, you know?
And you don’t have to answer that now. But like we explored that together of like, what was really stopping you from feeling that way. And you, you came back like very strongly, which is awesome. I came back and I think that what actually made the difference is what you taught me. That TOEFL is a game. I need to see, you know, pros and cons of everything, including TOEFL. And if I failed, it doesn’t mean anything about my abilities in the future. It doesn’t say anything. It just gave me this feeling that I need to improve. What exactly I need to improve. I can discuss with you. I got you. Right. I get your feedback. And I knew exactly every time I knew exactly what to do, how to improve myself. That’s awesome. And this is really big deal. It’s so exciting. I mean, yeah, it is. It is. And I, all I can say at the end of it is just congratulations. Cause I mean like, Oh my God, these scores are just, they’re just so awesome. Like I just think it’s so great and what I love, what I love. And you’re also like sitting here with this, this is, what’s so important. I really just want to highlight this. This happens. I’m just going to put this right here. This happens to like 90% of the people who work with me. This is something that happens where there’s these kinds of fluctuations where like here, you had this kind of drop in your reading score.
And then the next time it like bounced back up again, you know? And there can be this kind of drop in the writing and then it bounces back up again. There’s nothing to be worried about, you know? Cause like I see this all the time and when I see those fluctuations, like as captain of the TOEFL ship or whatever, I’m like, okay, no problem. We’re on the right track. But what happens for so many men and women in, in your situation, especially when they’re scared about making mistakes and then they see those fluctuations, they’re like, Oh God, I’m never gonna make it. And then they think that they should give up. Whereas from my perspective, I’m like, Oh my God, we’re so close. Stick with me. Like two more weeks, two more weeks. Like, all you gotta do is stay strong for like, we’re there, you know? And that is the point. This is the point right here.
What happened for you here in November is where so many people just like permanently give up or they just get like super, super exhausted and depressed or something and they just stop at that point. And what is awesome too, is like, you just kept going with me, which was part of it. You know? So I think that that’s important to recognize as well, like when people are chasing results and they’re wondering like, how is it going to happen? You know, a lot of people have the idea that it’s going to be easy at the end. I’m going to reach the point where like, I’ll get the scores and it’s going to be easy. And you fought for those scores. Like you had to fight to like get those at a certain point. You know, even if it’s just fighting yourself and the dialogue that you had with yourself about your own ability, you know? Right. Independent essays for me, 40. For anybody, that’s a lot of essays. Yeah. That’s a whole lot of essays. Yeah. You did. You definitely worked super, super hard. So if you, I mean, sometimes at the end of the journey we look back and the only way it could happen was the way that it happened.
I mean, do you, do you think there was anything you could have done differently years ago or was this, this was the journey. This was the only way. Would you do anything different or are you, are you peaceful with the way that at all? The only one thing that I can say that I regret that I didn’t meet you. Hmm.
Four years ago, six years ago, I should’ve asked her, where have you been all this…
Under a rock? Probably, probably dealing with my own insecurity about advertising and my own insecurity about being visible on the internet. Probably really. But yeah, that’s probably it. I think the timing was good for me at this point and everything just worked out well.
But I think if I, if I hadn’t met you last year, I probably wouldn’t have got this scores by myself. No, not for this short period of time and definitely not with, eh, my self esteem that time. That’s awesome. Well, I’m so glad that you found me and I’m really glad that you were willing to take a chance.
So I guess that means I’m really glad I went to go take TOEFL because I suppose that was the, that was the turning point for you. Not only for me, I think it’s really helpful for first of all, for you as a teacher and it’s a tool to help all the students, and this is something that you can use for, you know, for teaching process because… That’s why I suggest that teachers go do it. I don’t know why people don’t do this. You actually, by spending time and money, you saved money and time to yourself. I think. Yeah, It is that way. I mean, it’s true. It is. It’s true. It’s so true. It’s so true. Well, and you too though, by spending time and money studying this program, you’ve saved time and money according to your husband. To my husband. Yes. And yeah. I can tell you that my husband says the truth. Yes, absolutely. Always. I love it. Well, this is so good. Do you have any advice for anybody who’s still watching at this point, we’re going to wrap up.
So last words of advice. If you really want to get through the process and be done with TOEFL, do not hesitate. Take Jaime’s classes. You won’t be disappointed. It’s going to be the best investment in your future because this is what I did and I succeeded and thank you, Jaime. You’re welcome. Thank you for trusting and for following it.
So anybody, if you want to some find me at jaimemiller.com, we can have a consultation and talk about your situation. Olga, we’re going to let you go since you’re going to move on into 2021 with your career in front of you. So it’s very exciting. Congratulations. Thank you so much, Jaime. Thank you.
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